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Welcome fellow confidence crusaders, neuro nerds and success equalizers. This is your podcast, Real Confidence. I'm your host, Alyssa Dver, and I'll be sharing a bit of basic brain science, some surprising social secrets, and a touch of tough love. Why? Because I believe confidence is everyone's fundamental right and choice. So let's get to it.
Alyssa Dver:
This is one of my favorite all time topics. It's not something that we've done on Real Confidence, but I've done it in the past. And we're going to be talking about how and why taking pictures are having our picture taken, I should say, makes us a little wiggly. And I've got a wonderful expert who's based in London, Mervyn Reid-Nelson is with us his He's the founder of you and yours. And I love this moment, the way you describe your business, you said it was an emotionally sustainable photography studio. What does that mean, my friend?
Mervyn Reid-Nelson:
Thank you for that lovely intro. I really appreciate that this year. So I say that to sort of turn their heads away from the output. I teach photography, specifically, I teach nude photography, which is actually mostly about the space and consent and making sure that your subjects feels comfortable. And what I still get, even though you know, we put that on the header is people very focused on the output, like many of us are, what's the best angle? How do I look good? What's the what's the hack, right? Tell me the hack. And I say to everybody, we all have a candid photograph of ourselves. Oftentimes, that's because we're often not aware the photographs being taken. And so I say sustainable because I lean into what is organic, which is us being ourselves, I create a space where people feel safe enough to just be themselves and not be focused on the photographs. And that's how we get those images out.
Alyssa Dver:
Wow. Well, we are going to talk about some hacks for those of us who are getting headshots, and fully clothed. But before we get to that, yeah, of course, I'll tell you a little bit nude photos, like who's what kind of clients? What's the purpose? Like, when somebody comes to you I've like baffled somebody's like I want I want to be photographed in the nude, and they're not confident doing it. Like how does that happen?
Mervyn Reid-Nelson:
Well, firstly, I'll say that 95% of my clientele are women, and, as we know, certainly in the UK is that, you know, for men, when they have an issue, they bury their head in the sand and hope it goes away. And women are more proactive in trying to sort it out. And so, you know, I find most of my clients are women. And I will say that they have something about their body they don't like and maybe or they or they're learning to love, or they it's learning to accept let's take mothers, for example, who have given their bodies over the to their children through pregnancy, and maybe breastfeeding. And just age perhaps, and you know, they could just say, okay, settle into the mud, and this is me, or they could the alternative is how about I try and get back to some of that zest for life I once had, you know, as an example. And let me learn to love myself versus hide myself. And that's just one example. It could be post surgery, it could be, you know, someone had a grandmother who said, make sure you enjoy your body now, whilst you have it, you know, and they've been inspired by that conversation. And so they've decided to get some photographs taken of their body today in their prime minute voted comments.
Alyssa Dver:
That's great. I mean, wow. So they're coming to you. They're like, I'm trying to regain my confidence in my body specifically. And I want you to take photographs. So wow, that, that I think that is even above my threshold of brave, right? Like, that's fabulous. And so they come to you. They're asking for a specific type of photo and what are they going to do with these photos? What, what happens? You you get them in the studio, you take the photos, what do they do with them, and what's the result that you see afterwards.
Mervyn Reid-Nelson:
So again, let's put it back away from the photos. What we give here as an experience, very succinct analogy is the roller coaster, you queue up for this roller coaster where you decide if you want to get in line or not. And you queue up for this roller coaster. And you're so nervous, right, as you said, it's above your threshold. And then you get to the front of the line and the nerves kick in. You think you're gonna die, because this is the worst thing anyone could possibly do. Why would I want to want to have my photo taken naked? You know, and again, I want to stress you don't have to be naked. It's just if you're looking to overcome certain body image issues, you're better off trying to challenge those by seeing the thing right. So you get on this roller coaster, and you call your mom and you say hey, nice knowing you. Right and then that's it and then then the roller coaster takes off. And before you know it you actually really enjoying the experience. In fact, it's quite liberating, quite empowering, and you've got your arms up in the air and you're having a wild time. And then at some point, someone's taking pictures of you on this roller coaster. Most of the time, you're not even aware it's happening, because you're so involved in your own emotions and what's happening for you. And it's liberating. Today, I had a client who burst into tears midway through her session because of the movement she had in her body she didn't know she was even capable of. And so then you get off the roller coaster, you text a friend saying it's best best thing ever. And then you go over to the kiosk at the end and look at your photographs, and you decide what memories of this experience am I going to keep? So the focus is on the experience, the focus is on the roller coaster, the images are the side effect of you letting your hair down and being brave.
Alyssa Dver:
Oh, my gosh. So cool. I have like goosebumps based on what you're saying. And I may have to get on a plane just to experience it. Now, I plan on doing that at some point, that's, you know, your, your addition to my bucket list or my roller. Thank you. Um, you know, I want to ask you, though, you know, that's great that it's really more about the experience, but I'm sure you have dissected. Why do people freak out? Not just getting their photos? Like, it almost doesn't bother me to get my photos. But then I get that email that says, here's your portfolio, take a look. And I'm kinda like half I'm like squinting, because I don't really want to see them. I'm like, Yeah, I know what I look like, I see my face every now and then you're like, why is the photo? So confidence challenging?
Mervyn Reid-Nelson:
Great question. I want all of my clients that if they think the nerves coming into the session is bad, the ones coming in to see their images is doubly so right, nine times out of 10, they're going to be feeling worse, I've had people not show up, they're so convinced they're going to hate them, you know, and we go through, I mean, your listeners won't see this. But I'll show you for your benefit and empty tissue thing here. I look at this huge box of tissue that we go through, because people come into the office and cry their eyes out. Because they can't believe that's even possible. And there's no photoshopping, there's no filters, I don't understand, you know, and I say to them, This is what the rest of the world, this is how the rest of the world sees you when you're not trying to control it. And I think it's the control piece. That's the thing. It's the not having the control, it's the given that over to somebody else, which is, you know, our biggest insecurity is how we are how we appear in the world are one of our insecurities, you know, and being able to give that over and then having to see the results of that is terrifying. But I also say to them, you could hand it over to a lot worse people than you know, a photographer who's been voted the best in London for three years, and so on and so on. Right. So, you know, I'm not a dentist,
Alyssa Dver:
Right? Do you think that people though, when they see their photos, they go, Wow, that's not what I thought I look like or are they surprised me? You said they're surprised and tend to be happy. Now granted, you're probably so talented, you're grabbing their best moments, but I've had a lot of photo sessions myself where I go, Oh, I didn't realize I look so terrible. Like look at those bags under my eyes. Well look at those rings. Yeah, like, so? Why is there such an element of surprise.
Mervyn Reid-Nelson:
So, again, going back to the roller coaster, what we're doing is we're associating a feeling with the image. So a very beautiful story is a woman who came in who decided she was going to be completely conservative, totally her right. And I wasn't expecting any skin. And eight times out of 10 people go beyond what they think they're capable of doing in the day, right. And so in her case, she was doing star jumps completely naked on the bed, right? And boobs are clapping in the air like this, you know, she was having a wild time. And, and, you know, I took a photo of her midair. And she came in weeks later and saw these images. And I showed it to her because it was such a an amazing moment, not a flattering image at all. And that was the image where she burst into tears. And she said that was the freest I've felt in my life. And so when we remove the notion for perfect and trying to get the right photo and lean back into the memories and the feelings they can elicit, now we have freedom.
Alyssa Dver:
Right? And you know, as you're saying that first of all, thank you for sharing and being so cool about the way you describe it. That was just brilliant. I loved it. And a just such a poignant story to point you in the description. I suspect that we forget when we look at a photo when it's not us, right? We look at a photo we are trying to envision what that person's feeling what their experience is, we're not looking for their wrinkles in their dark circles, right and yet when we look at the image ourselves, here's kind of a half for me. Because we've already lived that experience. We know it so we do focus in on those little yes details. So we forget that other people are still trying their luck. Looking at that image, and they're trying to, they're seeing the experience, not the details, right?
Mervyn Reid-Nelson:
Absolutely. And I think where I have a struggle, my issue is education. Because what happens is people come to me not so much the website, but my Instagram, for example. And they see these really pretty pictures. And they think it's like a catalogue, I want one like that. And I want one that that except you haven't lived that person's journey, you don't know what brought them to that point, with when you have that expression, or that body movement. And so the photos are actually neither here nor there, it's, it's really, because that only really belongs to that individual, you know, and to your point, I think we can often remove, and sadly delete images, because we don't look the way we thought we should or how we recognize ourselves and completely undermine the memory, you know, like something that you will one day cherish that photo of you and your friends, even though you looked silly, it was the only photograph you had from that evening, and you haven't seen them in years, you know, and it's sad, because we're at a point now where everything is based upon external perception and how we look visually. And and, yeah, I can only do my bit, but then we have a lot more work to do.
Alyssa Dver:
Yeah. Oh,for sure. And, you know, I don't think, you know, LinkedIn or any of the sites that want that headshot type of thing. Now, I don't you don't see it a lot anymore. But we used to see people who would cut out, you know, they'd go to the some black tie event or something else, and they would cut themselves out of a photo that was taken, right. I think it underlines what you're saying they love, they were having a good time somebody shot a bone, and they're like, that's what I want to look like. And yet when people did that, were like, Come on, get a headshot, right. So we did the opposite, we encourage people to be kind of canned.
Mervyn Reid-Nelson:
Yeah, and and that's also to do with the photographer, and the feeling and how much time you give it, you know, what we offer now this year, is you go through the whole body confidence experience, you might even end up going nude that say, and having this totally liberating experience. And I mean, these people go off and like, ask people out on dates, or dump their boyfriends or, you know, go and get tattoos, they've they're turning corners before they even seen their photographs, right? Just to add. And so we're taking that emotion, and then we're saying right, now put your work outfit on. Now put your suit on, right? Because now they're in that state of power, confidence. And so that headshot is going to be levels above, if we had just brought them into a studio with a light and said, hey, smile for the camera, you know. So we're utilizing a feeling that everyone has in them, it's just that we don't often give it time often maybe don't know how to whip it up and utilize it in our everyday lives.
Alyssa Dver:
So yeah, yeah, well, alright, so here's what we're gonna do if you are game with me. So funny enough, recently, I brought a new person on the American Confidence Institute team. And she read and listened to everything that we've had just to kind of spin up and she says to me, you know, your photos do not reflect you. And I said to her why, and pretty much everything you said, it's the working I had photographers come in and write Yeah. And so while I'm not in the UK at the moment, I'm sure I'm not the only one who's going boy, I would really like to get better photos. Whether it's a headshot, or you know, something else that come on along. We don't have the benefit of having the body confidence experience with Marvin yet. But when we come back from our sponsor break, Mervin, would you give people some basic tips if there are such a thing for when they have to have a photo taken? or somebody's about to say smile? Is there something that they can do to feel a little bit more competent? Would you do that for my listeners?
Mervyn Reid-Nelson:
Absolutely.
Alyssa Dver:
I love it. All right, we'll be right back.
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Alyssa Dver:
Back with now one of my top all time favorite podcast guests Mervyn Reid-Nelson you have just lit me up but I am now maybe a little paranoid because I can't do the body confidence experience right now with you in London. And I know somebody's gonna take my picture and then next weeks or so whether it's a can photographer or somebody just walks up and advances you know, smile. What are your best tips to look and feel confident getting that photo taken and subsequently being able to look at it with eyes open?
Mervyn Reid-Nelson:
Amazing. So you said the word feel there, and it's something I'm gonna jump on, it's less about trying to, you know, do the hack and know what because everyone says, maybe you've told me the pose, we all look different. We all have different body shapes and sizes. And you know, there isn't one way to do it. But what I can give you is tools in which you can start to look more authentic. And that's what people want, we buy from people buy from people, right. So if you can tap into an authentic sense of confidence, or smile, or happiness, these emotions you can tap into, because you've had these emotions, you've lived these things, you've done something that nobody else in your life could possibly imagine, right? Whether you've climbed a mountain, or you've run a marathon, or you and if you're going for happiness, maybe thinking about a joke that your best friend told you yesterday, that made you wet yourself, you know, and, and it's these little things, and it takes a bit of practice. But if you can just tap into that emotion, like almost like a little exit door, you know, in your mind, then you can just sit in that emotion just for a brief second, it can light your eyes up in a way that you can't fake, you know, and some people are very good at it, they usually go on to be actors. But you know, day to day, I would say tap into the feeling. And the more you do it, the more you'll be able to because I can do it immediately, I can think of something and my eyes light up and my smile comes along as I'm doing now. Right? And it's just, it takes a bit of practice instead of you know, exactly, I guess if you try and hack it, you'll look a bit awkward. And then you see the photograph, and it confirms that fear. I look awkward? Well, of course you do. Because you were thinking awkward thoughts. So, yeah, I'd say that that's a key one.
Alyssa Dver:
I love it. I love it. You know, there's a technique that we use here called the confidence collection. And we encourage people to put anytime you get like a photo, a song, a quote, an email, a LinkedIn recommendation, anything that kind of like is a positive you rock moment, throw it into a file. And so like, I know a lot of people because they have gone through the institute, they use it regularly. I use it regularly, whenever I go do like a speech, because it lights me up and I you know, I want I'm sure it could light people up prior to that moment to that you said your you just want to like recall that memory, just bring in that photo, or bring in that song and be like, yeah, I rock.
Mervyn Reid-Nelson:
Exactly. And that's what this experience is for my clients, I am now providing them that moment where they overcame something. And now they have photographic evidence. And we've got things that sit in your wallet, we've got apps, so you can have your photograph on your phone, you know, and you tap on your back, and then your photos pop up. So it's about you know, being able to have these things present. And especially if it's photographs, try and print them, so you can see them. Because they'll they'll help you regain that sense of achievement or feeling or pride or confidence. Whatever it is that you had in that moment, instead of it just being number 65,000 in your phone folder.
Alyssa Dver:
I love it. I love it. I love it. I love it. And I can't wait to come to London and hang and let you do your magic with me and anyone who else is interested in learning more about you and getting in touch maybe getting an experience. And by the way listener if you do I want to hear all about it. How do people find you most easily?
Mervyn Reid-Nelson:
Head to Instagram if you're on there, that's where I'm most active on the internet. So it's youatyours on Instagram or one word you app to yours. Otherwise, head to the website, which is youatyours.com.
Alyssa Dver:
Perfect. Thank you so much for sharing your brilliance. Keep doing the beautiful confidence work your fellow confidence Crusader. And I'm so glad that you came into my orbit. Hopefully we'll be able to do something together going forward. But for today, thank you so much for sharing.
Mervyn Reid-Nelson:
My pleasure. Thank you for having me.
Alyssa Dver:
Before we totally wrap up, I want to let you know that full transcripts and show notes for this and other real confidence episodes can be found on www.AmericanConfidenceInstitute.com/podcast. I also want to remind you once again that the best way to get confidence is to give it to others and you can do it just by liking and sharing this episode on your preferred podcast and social media channels. You can even give me some confidence by noting topics you'd like me to consider for the future. So for now, this is Alyssa Dver. Thank you for helping to bring more confidence to the world.
Master editing done by Ben Weinstein with original music performed and composed by Jeff Mitchell. Real Confidence is a production of American Confidence Institute All Rights Reserved
