Ep 9: REAL CONFIDENCE- So You’re Ready for a Career Change with Special Guest Cat Breet
If you're smart and work hard, but just aren't where, who you want to be. Welcome to your podcast, Real Confidence. I'm your host Alyssa Dver, and I'll be sharing a bit of brain science, some surprising social secrets, and a touch of tough love. Why? Because I believe finances everyone's fundamental, right and choice. Let's get to it.
Alyssa:
All right. You lucky listeners. And I say that because I have something really special today as a guest, I met Cat Breet a couple of months ago, she had me on her podcast, which is phenomenal. You definitely have to check it out. It's called Planet Work and we'll give links in the show notes to everything cause Cat is also can give away some really cool tools that I've used personally. And they're really helpful, but I want to talk with this magnificent person who calls herself, the Chief Stripe Changer at ARBEZ. Now. I'm a career chameleon. I'm sure there's people on here too, but Cat Breet, you are not only a consultant, an author, coach, speaker, and podcaster, you do all these things from people who are in career change. You've had your own share, too, if I'm not mistaken.
Cat:
Oh yes, I have. And hello everyone. Uh, Alyssa, thanks so much for having me on, um, I you're right. I have had some really. Hard times in my career, which is why I am downright obsessed with helping other people get out of the pain if they're in a bad spot and figure out what is that dream career, dream job? Is it starting a business? Is it whatever? So yes, I have had some really painful experiences and it was hard. Just stand back up again really hard.
Alyssa:
Well, we all know that we've had bad bosses, but you have quite a story with what really catapulted you into this space. Would you share a little bit about?
Cat:
Yeah, absolutely. Ironically, I took a job as a recruiter. So, my job was to help people make smart career moves. I was working for a global consulting firm. I was 24 years old, and it was my first professional job. And I was so excited to be there. What I did not realize when I took the job is that it was a sales job. And I had to make 50 phone calls a day and hire, you know, five to 10 people per month. And you work on confidence, and this is no shock to you, but my biggest barrier to success in that role was my fear of failure and fear of rejection. And so, I wasn't doing well. I was really struggling, but I was fighting to succeed and I wanted to make it work.
And I was so excited to be there, but there was an SVP who. Had a very old school management style and she believed in, well, basically I call it public flogging. She would call people out in the hallway and in meetings and challenge us on how many phone calls did you make today? How many hires you're going to make? Like, just like Wolf of Wall Street. And I was 24; I did not have the courage and the tools to deal with her. And one day, I heard her voice in the hallway and I just, I could not stomach it. And instead of talking to her, I jumped out of my chair and climbed under my desk. Like talk about defining mortifying, humiliating moments. I couldn't believe I was doing it, but my body just moved and there I was hiding. It was ridiculous. But it was real. And that was the day I realized what was happening to me. And that I had to make a choice. I'm either going to stay in this job that is beating me, you know, bloody, or stand up.
Alyssa:
So, changing stripes obviously is a little scary. I don't know if most people crawl under their desk and fright, but I think they think about things like that. They think about, you know, not showing up for work and all the implications of, you know, making those changes. It's really not just confidence challenging. It's terrorizing. I think.
Cat:
It is. Well, it's a big deal. And you know, the stats when you are unhappy at work, which includes by the way, just being bored. There's a lot of languishing going on. People are good at what they do, and it's not that hard anymore, but they're bored. So anyway, when you're unhappy at work, you're going to have twice the levels of depression and heart disease- 41% higher healthcare costs. It's a big deal.
Alyssa:
Yeah, the moral of the story is that there's a lot of lousy, crappy, horrible bosses, but, you know, bullies. We've done a lot of shows on bullies because that's a perpetual topic when we talk about confidence and I think, you know, people can hear it in your voice, but the little bit that I know about you, like, it's amazing. Like you said that somebody else could control your emotions and your actions, but I think that's the recurring theme, right? Like we get into a work environment. We, whether we're good or not, to be honest with you, we are in that environment, we're trying to fit in or trying to get the job done with trying not to get fired. And then there's some kind of a wakeup call. You know, that, that moment of reckoning that says, what the hell are you doing?
And then they, you know, so your clients today, you you've made the complete career transition out of that too. You're running your own company and helping people again, still find that dream job, but on your terms, in terms of your business. So, let me ask a couple of questions relative to what kind of reckoning? What happens to people? What do they when they call you and say, Cat, I need to get out? What has happened? What is that moment that, enough is enough?
Cat:
You know, it's fortunately, most people do not get caught hiding under their desk. Um, but it's that moment when, when you know, it might be a moment when the boss beats them up publicly. Just one. They just realize it's, it's embarrassing, it's humiliating. And instead of crawling away with their tail between their legs, they get mad. So often it's where people just say, I I'm mad. I'm no longer going to sit and take it. I'm mad. So, they either are angry and they're starting to get irritable. And they, so I guess one reason people come to me for help is they don't like who they're turning in. That's probably the biggest bucket. They don't like who they're turning into. So, for some people they're becoming irritable for others, they're becoming angry for others. They're becoming super sad. And then there are health issues associated with this. Um, people also come to me because they're getting on the light end, headaches, and stomach aches. And I interviewed somebody last week who had a heart attack. He was only on this project, um, overseas for six months and a stress broke him down to the point where he literally had a heart attack.
So, it's really nice when you can catch it over something as dramatic as that, it's usually something like your spouse says what's going on. You know, maybe you do cry publicly at work. There's something that happens emotionally. That just makes you say enough, enough. Yeah, a lot of different reasons.
Alyssa:
Yeah. And those are all like, I guess good tells, right. There's we know statistically from some of the research that we are privy to that 40% of the workforce right now is looking for another job for one of those reasons. Right? That they're miserable. And I think the pandemic, if it taught us anything, it's not yolo. You only live once. Sure, but life is really short. And so, to have that kind of environment that you're mustering through is just not worth it. Right. So, it's not, it's just not worth it. So, you know, I'm interested in people are calling you up, they're like, hey, like I am miserable in my job. Is it automatically the reaction to leave? Hey, maybe there's something that you can do about it other than just leave.
Cat:
Yeah. And I'm so glad you asked that because unfortunately that was not my only bad boss in my career. I chose to stay, believe it or not. When I got caught hiding, I chose to stay at that company and wound up getting promoted and tripling my income just two years later. So, standing up to her was life-changing for me. But about 10 years later, I could not believe it. I woke up with another bad boss. It was so bad, my husband looked at me and said, I don't know who you are. I want my wife back. You've got to quit. And yeah, I know hindsight it's easy. Right?
I was mortified because he was calling me out. I thought I was handling it so well. I really thought I was handling it well, and he just like, what is going on? You got to quit. And I said, I can't and blah, blah, blah. Yes, you have to. And I said, okay, hang on. I hear you. And I know you're right. However, before I just quit, I need to figure out why am I so unhappy? And what's gonna make me happy because when I was 24, the risk was so low. I didn't have a mortgage. I wasn't married yet. I didn't have kids. Well, 10 years later, mortgage husband, kids, baby, on the way. And two parents, depending on me, like the risk of quitting was so much greater financially and life-wise so I said, I got to figure out why am I unhappy?
And what's going to make me happy and then I'll go make a change. So, I do not recommend people quit cold turkey. I do if they can afford the time. You know, if somebody is beating up at work and you're just an absolute mess and you're in the hospital. Yeah, get out. But I usually like to help people figure those things out and go get a new job or get a plan in place before they decide to jump out and start their own business. Yeah. So, the best thing to do is to figure out why am I so unhappy and what's going to fix it.
Alyssa:
Well, you, you know, there's a subtle message in there, right? Which is it's easy to blame the boss? It's easy to blame whatever the other thing is that's making you unhappy, but having that introspection and really understanding, maybe you are contributing to it, A, but B what is it you really want? Before you leap into another ship that's burning.
Cat:
Right.
Alyssa:
So really, I think oftentimes we think the grass is greener and it's actually brown or because we don't really know what we're looking for at the time. Very profound, you know, I'm wondering too, are people taking control? Do you see them taking more control or less control these days of their own career rather than rely on their employer? For example, for their career development, are you feeling that in the market right now?
Cat:
I am. And to your point, the pandemic was a wakeup call for millions of people. Unfortunately, there are a lot of people who either had to quit or chose to quit because they didn't feel they had the luxury of time to figure these things out. So, 2020 was really hard. There were a lot of people who, because of childcare and, and caring for loved ones, were forced to either quit or make rash decisions at work. Now what I'm seeing in 2021, thank goodness, we're all breathing a little bit easier. You know, we've adjusted to the new, a lot of the new reality. And so, this year, none of us have all the answers. It's certainly not perfect, but in 2021, I'm seeing a lot more thoughtful consideration before people leave, which is a beautiful thing.
Alyssa:
Okay. And you know, we're gonna spend enough get to kind of what people can do to make change, but before we even go there, do you, you hear and see so many different people's scenarios and everything, is it usually that they want to stay? You know, you, you ma you mentioned before all the financial reasons that were keeping you, for example, in that job, but we also have our egos, right? You didn't want to quit. You don't want to give it up. You make an investment in your career, you get really good at whatever you're doing. So, is it more often that they just want a better environment to do what they're doing? Or are they really looking to jump into something completely new or become an entrepreneur or something that's really different? Like how what's more common or is there such a thing.
Cat:
I would say what's more common now, which is very exciting for me. I jumped out on my own 15 years ago. There is a lot more appetite and action around people starting their own business. And I am a speaker. I've got online courses to teach people how to do this. And there are a lot more people right now who have the appetite and the courage to start their own thing. And some are doing it, what I call starting easy, which is with a side hustle. Some kind of medium risk, which is going through a staffing or consulting firm, but there are a lot of first-time small business startups, which is very exciting. So yes, Deb and I've been helping people become consultants for 23 years. So, there's a lot more of that than there ever has been before. It is easier than ever before to start your own business, especially to become a consultant, but not everybody, A, wants it. Not everybody has the stomach for it. And as you said, there are financial concerns. There are emotional concerns. So, I'd love to talk a little bit about that. I think what you were really alluding to is the fear is yeah. What if I don't succeed? But what about the loss of identity? What, what about the loss of those so-called secure paycheck? Fear is keeping a lot of people stuck and unhappy and sort of languishing in their careers right now, even after this pandemic.
Alyssa:
Yeah, well, you know, that's human nature. And of course, when we talk about confidence, it's, you know, everything about fear is what holds us back from doing the things that we really want to do value and otherwise need. So, I'm not surprised to hear you say that. So, what we're going to do is we're going to take a really quick break for our sponsor message and when we come back, I'm going to ask you, if somebody is in their job today, whatever that job might be, and they're like, I got to make a change and I really want to give our listeners some specific hints on how to do that. So, we'll be right back.
This podcast was sponsored by the American Confidence Institute. ACI trains smart, hardworking people, how to use basic brain science to more effectively coach themselves and others. ACI is endorsed by top universities, The Strategic HR Management Association, and international Coaching Federation. Learn more about ACI, uniquely empowering keynotes, workshops, classes, and coaching certification at www.americanconfidenceinstitute.com.
Alyssa:
We're going to dive into some tangible to do, hacks because you and I are like, get it done kind of girls. And it's easy for us to say, you're not happy in your job just make a change. Right? Like I can almost hear my mother-in-law in my ear saying, you know, just get on with it. Right. But it's not that easy. You're in a job again, you may have your ego at stake, financial requirements, all kinds of things. And whether people are looking for another job or going into the entrepreneurial mix that is keeping them not doing anything. So. Talk to me, like, what is your best advice? What are the steps somebody should have take right now when they know they're not thrilled with their current job, what should they do?
Cat:
Absolutely. First and foremost, figure out what you want. And this is not easy. And so, a lot of people think about it, but they don't know how to figure it out. And when I say what you want, you need to look at life and career and family and all of it. The whole ball of wax. So, one easy way to way to get there is to ask yourself what is missing. What do you want more of in your life and in your career right now? So, what's missing? What are you hungry for? What are you aching for? I just talked to somebody this morning. Who's working 12-hour days. She is aching to be done with work at five o'clock in the evening, so she can go jump in the lake and have dinner with her family.
So, what is missing? What do you wish you could have more of? Number two, what are your non negotiables? What are some your values what's really important to you? And chances are good. If you're unhappy, somebody crossing that line along your values, whether it's time, flexibility, integrity, whatever it is. So, what do you want more of? What do you want less of? And if there were no barriers, what would you want to be doing for work? So that first step. It's part where's the pain and then the journey. I've got some tools I'm going to share just in a little bit, Alyssa, a free download for everybody to help them figure these things out. So, number step one. What do you want? Step two. I already mentioned it. The non-negotiables. So, in other words, if you're going to make a change, what are your stakes in the ground? Are you going to refuse to work 60 hours a week? Are you going to refuse to commute? Whatever it is for? It's very personal. So, what are your non-negotiables third?
Reality check. So, I hope you dream crazy big. There are no barriers, but then number, step three. Is, are you ready right now? Do you have everything that you need in your toolkit? Do you have the skills experience money in the bank? If you want to start your own business, are you ready right now? What are the gaps? If any, and Alyssa, confidence, this is what you do for a living. It's so funny. Half the people are aiming huge, which is beautiful, but they're afraid to even look at what's missing. And the other half are so afraid of failing and the risks that they, they don't think they're ready and they're ready right now.
So anyway, what's missing. Get clear about that. Step four, rally the troops. All of us have people that think we rock they're in our corner. They would love to help us figure out what's next and take the leap, but you gotta let them in. So that's step four and then step five, just get out there and do it. Nike logo, right. Tagline, just get out there and do it. So that's my little five-step process to help people figure out what they want and then how to figure out the best next step.
Alyssa:
I like that the first step I was kind of like what's missing. I think that that we should be doing that regardless career. And you know, long ago I developed this, confidence dashboard and it really looks at, I always describe it as the buckets of our life. So, the buckets and your job. What are the things that are low? And if you can kind of even reconcile that, I think that's an amazing place to start. So thank you for sharing that. So, you went through that, of course, people can rewind and listen again, but you did mention that you have some tools that people can grab and do some of these things. So where is the best place to get to you and those goodies?
Cat:
Yeah, absolutely. So, the free priority scorecards, so one of the you've alluded to fear and identity and all of those things. You have to figure out how to remove your emotion and your little when her critic from these decisions. And so, I had to do this for myself. This was the only way I could figure out, should I stay? Should I go, blah, blah, blah. So, it's a priority scorecard. It's a little workbook and you can get it by going to catbreet.com/download-priority-scorecard. And I'll give Alyssa, a link, so she can put that in the show notes. So, it'll give you my exercises and the one other thing that it helps you do that I didn't mention is in that section, figuring out what you want, I ask you, what are you afraid of? It's that what's the worst that can happen.
So, if you decide to chase that dream and get what you want out of your career. You have to be willing to look your fear in the face and say, what if I go after it and it doesn't work out? What's the worst that can happen? Because only when you're willing to face that fear, can you come up with a plan B and you know what? Every single one of us has a plan B, a plan C. In fact, there are what, 26 letters in the alphabet, A, B, C, there are always options. And the sooner you're willing to look at your fears, the sooner you'll realize. Well, I'll be sad, but guess what? Then this can happen. Yeah, that's all in that scorecard.
Alyssa:
That's awesome. So, it's interesting because you and I met on your podcast talking about confidence and so forth, and you don't even know this, it's just a wonderful coincidence. The coaching that we do at the American Confidence Institute circles around the three fears of confidence, which is fear of failure, fear of regret, and fear of rejection. And we always say, once you can nail down that fear, the rest is easy. Right. Cause you have the answers, you have options, and you can figure out which is your best option subjectively or not. And I love what you said. I not only believe it, but I also practice and preach it on a minute-to-minute basis. So, I'm excited to not only use your tool myself, I'd love to take a look at it for my own career purposes, but I'm hoping that a lot of people will take a look and get in contact with you, because I think that really is aligned with getting your confidence in check, putting a plan together. Doing something that really aligns with your values, your, your wants and your needs, which is what confidence is all really about. And changing jobs, changing anything is hard, but when you’ve got Cat in your corner, it’s a lot less scary. And I appreciate that. I have one last question for you, I guess, you know, in hindsight, you know, you went through this trauma, I don't want to overuse that word, but it was traumatic. It sounds like it would be traumatic, you know. And looking back with everything that you've learned now, everything that you have helped other people with, is there one thing that you're just like, dang, I wish I knew this back then.
Cat:
Yeah. You know, it's so funny you asked me that my oldest son just turned 18 and he asked a brilliant question of my husband. He said, what would you tell your 18-year-old self? And I would look at that little, I mean, 24, I was so bright eyed, and bushy tailed and painfully insecure. And I would tell that 24-year-old young woman do not let anybody steal your power and treat you that way. If somebody makes you feel like a piece of dirt, they don't belong in your life, and you deserve more and you are better. And invest, do what you need to do. Go to the Confidence Institute. The most it's important thing for me to do at that stage in my life and today is to work on my confidence, finding courage and I didn't know it. I didn't realize that that was a skill that I needed to focus on and work on. So, I think just when you feel that when you feel it so low, it is a sign. You call it a tell, that's a sign something's got to change, and you need to hear it and do something about it. Do not sit and fester and languish in a place with people who make you feel like that because you deserve more. You are better and you're in the wrong spot. You're with the wrong people.You're in the wrong spot. And you know what, Alyssa, the here's the here's what my last message today is that my toxic boss might be your dream boss. My toxic job might be your dream job. And so, you've got to be careful not to look to other people for the answers you've got to go inside. You are the only person who can figure out what's that best next step for you. And it's different than it is for everybody else. Yeah.
Alyssa:
Yeah. So, who people know my work, also know that I say, it's unfortunate we have to wait until on average, we're 60 years old to figure it all out. And I said before, you know, we're kind of transitioned from a yolo to life's too short. I'm going to put a little corollary on that too, that I've learned in my almost 60 years of life who says life's too short to hang out with people that don't rock your world.
Fortunately, I have figured that out and I picked awesome people, including you, my friend, Cat Breet and other folks that are tuning in, please check out Cat's website, call us, let us know, like share, do some great things with this podcast or somebody that, you know, maybe needing that signal, may need that little extra push to say, Hey, you know, it's time for you to make that change. And even if it's a small change or if it's a big change we got in covered. So yeah, for today, I want to thank you for joining and as usual, I want to encourage you to get more confidence in greatest way is by giving it to somebody else.
So, thanks so much. We'll talk to you next pod.
This podcast was produced by Mindful Media. All rights reserved Alyssa Dver and the American Confidence Institute. Music written and performed by Jeff Weinstein.
